Stop Me Before I Vote Again

I just finished reading the same piece on CounterPunch and thought for sure you’d have something to say about it. Whad’ya know, you did! Well, I’m totally in agreement with our cranky comrade and always thought the Occupy Shmoccupy lacked focus and organization. They cast a wide net with their 99% jargon and at the end, they couldn’t even organize 1% of this 99%. Why not focus on one “shafted” group at a time? Say for instance, instead of putting all that effort in occupying a park and bringing tents and food and whatnot, why not occupy the fucking Unemployment Office and appeal to the ranks of unemployed that are growing daily? Why not target the young by organizing the victims of the student loan scam? What would happen if every young person without a decent job refuses to pay his student loan?

Maybe I’m too simple minded but some of the options they could resort to seem a hell of a lot more fruitful than schlepping to a park and setting up shop there.

Bitch, bitch, bitch... I'm shocked, shocked that there's disorganized incoherence going on in here! The "point" of Occupy, if there was/is one was to peel back for a brief moment the opaque mask of interminable Red/Blue sham "politics" over who gets to hold the knife that carves the bird to serve to the beast. That is all you get. A momentary glimpse. That may be all you need. It may not.

"But I held my tongue..."

Watch out, Alex. If you hold your tongue too long, people may think you're playing with it.

"to michael j smith and al schumann , of your being the two of the group here that tried to respond to some of my commenting over the month of june , re- my mention at 8:51am above in this streaming of commenting , of what i had said that i would continue on when i could of .. . of my mention of something of the latest of occupy beginning here ( in this.. by the lake.. . that is the largest gathering place of the most diverse in unlike by the nature of the lands from, of what the land creates of , like something of huxley sr 's friend d. and others of birds ,of this of landing and moving in their making ,of what they now are of migrating , .. gathered in living ), the spring before last early , it was a small gathering of elders , of those that are more native to this land , of part of it's literal scape, from of north and south of , nomading, of a new word , of not being of a roaming wander in their reach out, .. respected ,gentle chosen of their able beauty to move others in all ways good , the gathering was in the back of a fair .. cafe ,run here by some from south of your border , the group was of an archaeology dig , of something of this long steep sided past the discussion ,from there those of this small gathering moved out in to what is now something of the core of the occupy movements , still unknown by most , i will say more in time but not here , i need the help of those that are better able in their communicating in telling more of , of able to communicate in a .. not so much of water dried and other .. . of what i am in the no wheat's sway and more .. of belly ,means corsage of winnowing gather of writing .. . with no hearing of the literal of my voice , said not sybil / note - - i did not continue with my comments on my father of father 's work for the board of education on the post where i made that comment, because i did not hear back from owen paine by mail, there was a reason to why i commented with that on that post , and of what i added to the first post on montreal comments connected as well ,on the law abider .. post , .. . of my family/famille connect to the under lay and lettering of the globe and mail here in the past as well as .. . " shew to alec

"The Occupiers, with their “people’s mic”, were always a little hard to understand...

They came up with the "Peoples' Mic" after the police forbade the use of bullhorns in an attempt to silence public speakers in the park. If you can't understand them, you need to shut up and listen. (Christ... like a Zippo without a flint, this guy.)

...And as with all movements involving consensus, everything took a very long time.
 
Was there perhaps a leader, a small leadership group, sequestered somewhere among the tents and clutter?...

"Don't follow leaders! Watch the parking meters!"
-Dylan.

...Cynicism about Occupy was not a popular commodity.
 
But new movements always need a measure of cynicism dumped on them...

...because otherwise they may gather enough confidence to succeed. Christ, Alex...

People have written complicated pieces trying to prove it’s not over, but if ever I saw a dead movement, it is surely Occupy...

You wish, Alex.

I agree with Mr. Merkin's sentiments unreservedly and wholeheartedly. His words ring especially true after reading his report on the student strike in Ottawa.

Comrade Paul, first off, I'm not a Mr., I'm a Madame! Secondly, I reported on the student strike in Quebec, my new refuge from Dumbfuckistan. Other than that, glad to see we're on the same page.

Ace is used to being disappointed. All of us of a certain age are. He's armoring himself, as one must.

I get it, though I don't entirely share it.

My four or five forays with the Occupiers shook at least ten years of age off my gimpy shoulders; and I had a few long talks with some pretty committed Occupiers whose attitude toward history was the opposite of what Ace reports. They picked my brain clean of 60s memories, and were very interested.

Madame from Montreal,

You must forgive us innocent SMBIVAns. The only Merkin we have heard of is pictured here:

http://moviegoings.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/bald.jpg

We blush at our naïveté...

Aacchh! Another day, another demolition. It's Uncle Alex's turn. I don't begrudge him. Much. But I'm moved to say, so what? Some of the demolitions can be intellectually defended, for whatever the exercise is worth, and often enough there's a condition of collapse that can be held up in support. A dissection of that collapse *could* have value for the next attempt, and the one after that ad infinitum. But it's better to do it sympathetically, in the company of the people who tried, and didn't quite make it as far as they'd hoped.

Quebec's Silent Revolution eventually foundered, but it was huge and it had a lasting impact. Same with the Civil Rights Movement and the wild thrashings of the New Left. I suppose all could be "proven" to have changed very little, ultimately, just as Occupy can be "proven" to have failed. Again, so what?

It's irremediably trite to say this, but those are the breaks. Try. Fail. Try again and try to learn.

Why are we taking about Occupy in the past tense? Why the obits for a movement that's still alive?

sandy
" "But I held my tongue..."

Watch out, Alex. If you hold your tongue too long, people may think you're playing with it."

that is for sure the very nub of it all

wag it more then twice and you're playin with it

for christs sake
al be cocky
wags his wag-able wag wag
every weekend at CP

like i beat meat
the night b4 junior year finals
at choate
spring 1964

"those ARE the breaks"

to me a new generation
of class system wranglers
was born last fall

and i say to em all
god's speed you bastards god's speed

u showed up
none too soon

reference point

me that very spring of 64
at friends house in darien

we were AWOL

http://earthmart.blogspot.com/2012/07/blog-post_07.html

Alex Cockburn grumped:
There were other features that I think quite a large number of people found annoying: the cult of the internet...

So, what would you suggest, Mr. C? That they suck up to the likes of MSNBC and hope they threw a few bones of favorable coverage their way? From what I could see, the supposedly "progressive" babbling heads on MSNBC used Occupy the way politicians used crowds of citizens as the backdrop for a foto op -- and literally, in the case of Ed Schultz, who opened his show one evening last February doing a live "stand up" from Wisconsin with a boisterous crowd of protesters behind him.

...the tweeting and so forth, and I definitely didn’t like the enormous arrogance which prompted the Occupiers to claim that they were indeed the most important radical surge in living memory...

"The tweeting and so forth" was -- along with several blogs and the Al Jazeera English Service Website -- one of my prime sources of real, actual breaking news from Occupy on the streets. I sure as hell didn't get jack shit for news from any goddamn' TV show.

Oh, yeah, and this late word just handed me, Alex: Occupy is the most important radical surge in living memory -- this includes the late '90/early '00s antiglob movement, before they were latched onto and bled dry by the parasitic Donkeycratic Party.

Where was the knowledge of, let along the respect for the past?.... when one raised this history with someone from Occupy, I encountered total indifference...

Well, Mr. C, just how did you present your knowledge and experience from the past -- as an equal with some wisdom and experience (and perhaps a great old war story or two) to offer, or as a pompous old bastard who thought that the current generation didn't know how to build a proper movement, and that his generation did it better, talking down to the Occupiers as if they were children?

I won't speak for any other "movement" vets my age (mid 50s), but I was received quite well by the mostly 20- and 30-something Occupiers in DC, though I'm sure my reputation in the local activist community probably helped. The folks in the newspaper/media workgroup dug my cartoons right away -- they've already picked up a few recent pieces for their Web site and their print rag -- and also greatly appreciated my video work for DC Indymedia. Overall, they seemed really glad to have me around, and to know someone who'd actually been somewhere and done some shit. My approach was "here's what I do, here's a link to my blog and my YouTube channel, and if you've got any questions or just wanna talk, here's where you can reach me." No snotty superior attitude, just "this shit's awesome, thanks for doing this, let me know what I can do do help, way to take it to 'em."

This was in stark contrast to the antiglob movement of a decade or so ago, where the general philosophy seemed to be the tired old "don't trust anyone over thirty" crap. I was already kind of an old guy, hitting my mid-40s when Seattle and A16 happened, and many of the people in the meetings acted as if they were paying me a big honor by simply allowing my raggedy old hippie ass in the room.

...There also seemed to be a serious level of political naivety about the shape of the society they were seeking to change. They definitely thought that it could be reshaped – the notion that the whole system was unfixable did not get much of a hearing.

On this point -- this one point -- Cockburn might have something. As much as I'm totally rooting for Occupy, I have a bit of an issue with a lot of the reformist thinking going on. They've taken a huge and much-needed step by recognizing and publicly stating that the Democrats are as big a part of the problem as the GOP, but I think they're making a huge mistake by assuming that the current system can be fixed. One thing I learned from working with the antiglob movements is that the current system is beyond repair and needs to be destroyed to clear the space to build a system that serves the needs of all of us, that achieving this requires a revolutionary agenda rather than a reformist agenda, and that this will require action and not just protest.

That said, I'm still Team Occupy all the way.

It's always over. It's also always never over. Occupy in its wonderful 2011 form may not come back as such. But the people will be back, having learned a lot.

That said, I'm still Team Occupy all the way.

Anytime anyone (prematurely) declares a ragtag movement dead, I reply with three words: The Early Christians.

alex throws out a challenge
to us old tart pinks that
became instant OWS worshipers

"I do think it’s incumbent on those veteran radicals who wrote hundreds of articles proclaiming a religious conversion to Occupyism...."

"to give a proper account of themselves"

otherwise
"it will happen all over again"

Merkin,

Had the Occupiers done what you suggest, ... addressed issues (effects) one by one, they would never have had the overwhelming support they did.

Instead of doing what you suggest, they attacked the belly of the beast, the unrelenting cruelty and greed by a small percentage of Monsters ...which are ruling the day ....and night.

I honestly think the UZ will start seeing immolations (one lighting themselves afire) in a raging protest against the astounding cruelty which is - and has been for over a century now - raging here; much like is seen in so many other, far older, hopeless "nations."

(after all the UZ is already witnessing humans combining lethal mixes inside autos (they’ve been forced to live ‘from’ as they cannot afford shelter?) where the suicidees post warning signs on the windows ...for those who still have ‘hope’ ....not to open the car door ....as death resides in the auto’s ‘womb’ .....)

A less dyspeptic take on Occupy. And someone who advises to 'always keep an eye on Québec'.

Mme. Merkin, please forgive me my extreme ignorance! I can excuse myself for the gender mix up as I can't figure it out from your name, although perhaps I have shouldn't have used a gender specific honorific. BUT saying Ottawa instead of Quebec is completely inexcusable! I feel so...AMERICAN!!!

Paul, don't feel too bad. Their inter-provincial harmony can sometimes make it hard for outsiders to tell them apart.

Comrade SK, thanks for the excellent link to "Always keep an eye on Québec". Also, I loved the clip from Bon Cop Bad Cop.

But what’s with all this Alex bashing? Ok, so the guy is a pompous ass but the point of his essay is a call to an honest analysis of what went wrong with the Occupy movement. Ok, I get it, so the movement is not dead (at least according to some of you) but what could have been done better? To my mind, it certainly lacked focus and a clear solid demand. For example, at a time when most Americans found banks and banksters evil, you would think a cry for prosecuting the head motherfuckers of say, Countrywide, Lehman, or B of A would have gone a long way. The least it would have accomplished was to unite the masses and build momentum. Now, am I being too harsh on the “kids”? Well maybe, it’s a dirty job but somebody’s got to do it!

Merkin,

Given the Brit petri dish the UZ has always been, .....particularly as to slavery supported (actually necessitated) “capitalism,” 'uniting the masses' in the UZ is not at all the same as in other - most of them far smaller, far more homogenous(in terms of land mass and race/nationality) - countries.

The 'foreclosure' crimes (Countrywide, etc.), in the UZ, may have had far less a united effect as they would in another country due to the totally unacknowledged millions, in the UZ, forced to rent, who've have never been able to afford a home, or patch of land, no matter how small or simple.

diane

i admire your uncluttered view
of
our dear USA today

i recall a maoist group of the 70's here
that studiously refered to the states
as the united states of north america
just the slight
overly fastidious alteration
triggered a total new look
at "this land"
that is "our" land

understated elegance

Apparently there's a term in Dungeons and Dragons circles, "grognard" that is used to refer to old gamers who spend all their time complaining about how awful the newest edition of their favorite game is and how it's designed for a bunch of kids who need everything handed to them on a plate, not like when I played D&D and my character had to walk ten miles uphill in the snow before he got to level two...

There are a lot of protest grognards out there.

I, as a young person with no experience protesting, do not read Cockburn's article and come away thinking, "I sure want to go out and make the next Occupy movement really amazing!"

This is an "I told you so" not a pep talk.

Also, as I am a follower, not a leader, I get really annoyed at how all these protest grognards always end up talking at the grand strategic level. Oh, you should have made your message more focused! What does that actually mean, specifically, when you're out on the street? Fuck, if you were worthy of the movement, you'd already know.

C

"There are a lot of protest grognards
out there."

i share your view on that

and on Alex's implicit i told u so

i coulda told you so
but "i held my tongue"
as to pep talk
guys like Alex specialize in downers

Thank you Owen, you’ve warmed my day (once again). It’s alwaysa wonderful feeling (at least to me) to be understood, and even more special to be in agreement ... when everywhere one reads of the core societal aspirations of the powerful, one starts to wonder how another human could even think so viciously.

I’m inspired by your push towards doing something to fight back (as in your latest post, directly above), and love that you have no illusions that the Dems have any plans to help anyone but themselves (with few, if any, exceptions), even though I don’t, and currently can’t, post a lot.

Have a wonderful evening, Owen, thank you for the warmth.

The supposed heterogeneity seems to be based on the assumption that land mass, "race" and number of people corresponds proportionally to similarity;

'uniting the masses' in the UZ is not at all the same as in other - most of them far smaller, far more homogenous(in terms of land mass and race/nationality) - countries.

not an analysis of the polically significant features of the country in question. Between mass media and a highly uniform education system, I would say us Norte Americanos are quite startlingly similar so far as political and economic thinking goes, especially toward the West Coast, where populations are rootless and mobile, preventing the establishment of distinct, if even superficial, cultural characteristics developing. To use the UK as an example; I found as much cultural difference between Edinburgh and Glasgow--a fifty minute First-Scotrail ride apart--than New York and L.A., separated by a couple thousand miles.

In fact, if the U.S. were not incredibly homogenous we'd have torn ourselves apart long ago... to the benefit of the rest of the world, if not ourselves.

I do agree that because most proles aren't homeowners the Subprime didn't touch many souls. But in this re: the media--it has to be said--were brilliantly successful at making shady mortgage-lending practice--duly stamped out--to be the cause of every economic problem the country has, taking heat off the real culprits.

To qualify my comment above, it is true that poor people are divined up into isolated ethnic enclaves, and because of this potential solidarity would be thwarted. I'd say, nowhere is this more apparent than here in New York. But the reasons for the division aren't differing political understanding for the most part--Dominicans in my neighborhood would probably give about the same answers to a poll as white stiffs in Besonhurst--it is more a kind of xenophobia, probably encouraged, as much as possibly, by the ruling establishment.

But once one climbs a little higher up the class ladder the differences seemingly vanish, so one can have Filipino project manager, a Mexican art director, an Irish programmer and a Ghanian copywriter all working happily along side each other.

In general we are a very homogenous lot, and such tension as there is is found almost exclusively among poor probably taught to blame each other for their misery rather than an econonmy that's taking advantage of them.

pw

the most blatant contradiction of this unifying brain wash effect of schooling and media
is probably the market divergent political profile of american middle class white versus blacks
not that native americans
and chicanos aren't also

we contain multitudes indeed
and there are multitudes
of our various helot nations among em

however its the political hegemony of the white nation here that is the source of the horrors

so fragmentation is not the root problem
the root problem is...

well the white nation has turned
this beautiful huge and varied
seized land
into a prison house for "lesser" nations

the schvartzers are up to their old tricks in new york and other cities. oh well, there goes your revolution kiddies. you see, people like to be able to swim in public pools in 100 degree heat and they like to be able to walk down the street and not get shot by an ak47. that's how people actually live, they don't live in little abstract comment cages with 'marxists' and 'anarchists' who are lily white and went to good schools. If the schvartzers have a time of it this summer, mr fadduh smith will be hiding under his bed on west end, wetting his red diaper and calling 911, those bad coppers.

pw
missed second comment

excellent refinement

oh my, the CorpGov Nooz ...had ‘warned’ about the national stink bug invasion (after waiting for centuries), but they hadn’t warned about the bloodsucking sand flea invasion.

I bought one of my brothers a bleak humor book quite a while back, ...about fleas. It turned out to be very fascinating: ....apparently, their eggs can lie dormant ...waiting to hatch at the scent of blood.

Of course I’m analogizing here, ....the fleas above, hatched with the scent of human warmth, something humans are quite .profoundly and bewilderingly capable of, even if it means being willing to be held up to ridicule.

I get much of what you say Peter, but I’m still feeling that difference as to the UZ, maybe I can put it into words, what I’m feeling and thinking, in a bit (it’s not even quite clear, in terms of a communicating language, to me yet).

(sorry if this commment is duplicated, or worse. my land line dial up connection, cut off as I was attempting to 'post')

(sorry, just in case it's misread, was not, at all, including Peter as one of the blood sucking fleas. And shit, sorry for not deleting that stupid period mark (between the words: "quite" and "profoundly," after editing something I had initially written.)

Still trying to verbalize my point Peter, will say I believe it has much to do with the fact that capitalism, and it’s inherent, unique barbarism , under the lie of Freedom and Liberty for “all” ....could not have been instituted in those, ‘across the pond,’ older (and therefore wiser to the power plays of the obscenely wealthy and powerful), far more populated and ‘civilized’ countries. ....For one, those older, far more heavier populated, countries would have never been so accepting of massive importations of foreigners automatically presumed to be more skilled and intelligent than they the ‘natives.’ And certainly the concept of African Slaves, couldn’t have taken such hold in older European civilizations where they already had masses of lighter skinned poooor in countless vicious, industrialized cities (versus those who could at least ‘homestead’ in the Americas).