Stop Me Before I Vote Again

For me it depends a lot on just who the boooters are. If they're mostly or even largely home-grown, well, that's one thing. But if they're mostly ginned up by Uncle or some other unsavory external party -- like Saudi Arabia -- that's a different story.

Bullshit...

That ought not to cause any soul searching.

Guess who's shilling for US wars? But, then for anyone who followed pronouncements of these partisans of Responsibility to Protect (R2P for the cognoscenti), their strategically blinkered vision should no longer cause any surprise. As someone with a working memory noted:

That the first widespread exposure of the systematic application of torture in Israel's prison system was reported by the Sunday Times rather than Amnesty International was no mere coincidence.

"i say its a non issue"

It's none of our goddamn business. America needs a huge dose of Butt the Fuck Out and Mind Your Own Goddamn Business medicine.

It's just more of the old white man's burden bullshit. How about we mind our own affairs and let the folks over there mind to their own affairs.

In practice it seldom causes any soul searching for me. Owen's point about insurgents acquiring weapons wherever they can is fine as far as it goes, but Uncle doesn't provide a quo without expecting a quid.

It's not just a question of 'business', as Michael Corleone says -- an arms-length relationship, you might say. Uncle is buying control and generally gets it.

DP's point about Butt the Fuck Out pretty much sums up my own views as well; in fact, that's such a rock-bottom conviction that it doesn't even take any thinking about.

What seems less clear is the character of the insurgency itself, and therefore what one thinks about them -- not that it matters much, alas, what one thinks about them; but the impulse to figure things out, even with inadequate evidence, dies hard.

The fact that they seem to be depending heavily on Uncle Sam and Uncle Saud says something about them, I think.

I've come to believe that the Butt the Fuck Out principle is so essential and fundamental that one should even quell the impulse to figure things out, or at least let the feeling pass. While MJS's impulse is no doubt benign, that impulse generally is the first, albeit tentative, step toward trouble. To me, Butting the Fuck Out necessarily includes Don't Even Think About It!

Nice, CZ. I'm going to steal that.

"Uncle doesn't provide a quo without expecting a quid."

indeed
and that lead's to this inquiry:
are the insurgents
"mostly ginned up by Uncle "

we non-intervenors
have an obligation to ferret out
the facts ...and if its
an uncle funded op
expose it etc

classic case the contras
nicaragua 80's but that was easy
angola in the 70's

but the list is long and on going

exposing these connections is indeed
"our job"

--------------------

btw

"what one thinks about them"
requires consider

in my mind
a deeper evaluation of what quid
is "worth" what quo
is still on the agenda
for us plain pinkos of america

little comes of
rapid "contagion1" reactions
to resisters or new rev/rad states
found in "intercourse"
with the hegemon
or more generally his home grown
trans national corporations(both open and covert versions of course)

reflexes like this
"It's none of our goddamn business"

rarely alter facts

if the "our" here is uncle
that's just wolf ticket time

if the "our" is
us pwogs and assorted other good people

we ought to look into it all
at any rate

and
of course insurgent outfits like the farc
are easier to evaluate
because of their long and zig zag history

a slapped together ad hoc outfit
presents a deeper problematic

and all this requires a reversal of POV

not our conscience but their struggle

how we pinkos here react is less important
then how we act

our resources are limited they need to retain their focus and yet not over focus

easy words troublesomely hard to implement

i think we over focus on israel/ palistine for example and the cast of strugglers in that quagmire

and under focus
on say colombia and the philippines

"During two weeks in northern Syria, three Associated Press journalists counted more than 20 rebel groups, with anywhere from fewer than 100 to more than 1,000 fighters each. They go by names like the Idlib Martyrs Brigade and the Shield of the Revolution, and while all share a deep hatred of President Bashar Assad’s regime, their unity stops there.

Simply put, no one is in charge."

The Eagle, College Station, TX -6/24/12
http://www.theeagle.com/article/20120624/BC0107/120629763/1031

Some info but I'd say with evident 'supply the rebels' bias - the same rebels who should have no problem obtaining funds and materiel.

WHAT THE HECK
have not yet read it but

THE STRUGGLE FOR SYRIA IN 2011
http://www.understandingwar.org/report/struggle-syria-2011

no idea why but
gut saying kla

The Wahhabi movement has a long association with Western imperialists going back almost to its founding. Over the years the British and Americans have made use of non-traditional Muslim sects and organizations to help carry out their agenda through divide and rule tactics.

"Needless to say, this alliance or collusion between the West and Islamist did not originally
arise with the invasion of Afghanistan by Soviet troops. Its provenance can easily be traced
back to the challenges faced by British Imperialism in the earlier part of the twentieth century.

As we shall see, in Egypt, India and in what became known as “Saudi Arabia”, the British
Empire, when faced with challenges to its occupations or policies fell back on Islamism or
Islamic sectarianism to hold back the tide of independence and unity against its presence."

http://ikhras.com/2011/09/guest-post-british-strategy-and-911-blowback/

Given how often Al Qaeda has been found fighting on the side of US interests in multiple countries and conflicts, always conveniently appearing wherever rent-a-thugs are needed, I find it near impossible to view Al Qaeda as some sort of independent entity carrying on a war against the US. Ditto for the Libyan or Syrian "rebels."

After pulling off a tremendously sophisticated attack on 9-11, they haven't so much as lobbed a mortar round across the Rio Grande or set off a car bomb at one of the border crossings, which any idiot could pull off. Apparently their services are no longer required domestically.

http://www.habilian.ir/en/News/al-qaeda-a-tool-for-west-to-push-start-politicalmilitary-adventure.html