Stop Me Before I Vote Again

If Daily Kos and Sara Robinson ever breed, we'll have an epidemic of yuppie berserkers, not something I'd want young people to witness.

""body" -- it came out as "botty"."

I think what he's trying to there is pronounce an "O" but he ends up mangling the "D" in the process. I've noticed that Americans in many areas (pretty much anywhere 100 miles from the coast) have real difficulty pronouncing O's or U's in a lot of words.

I always wondered where Americans got the idea that Canadians say "aboot", which I've never heard in my life, despite growing up in a rural area that was so Canadian it hurts. After spending a bit of time in the US I realized what was going on: hot sauce is pronounced "hat sass", body is pronounced "badie", about is pronounced "abat", so when they hear someone actually pronounce "about" correctly, it sounds like "aboot" to them, and "body" sounds like "botty".

thank u father S

i recall a close personal grad school" mate "of yours

a comical chap
of lean dimension
complete with ichabodish nose and gate
http://www.botar.us/foto/sleepyhollow3.jpg

he was applying
his kant
to the corporate flow chart
of some sub galactic limited liability enterprise
and with great relish

bob, it sounds closer to us to "a boat." (Also, "sorry" often sounds like "sore e.")

This is a genuine difference.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_raising

bob

we don't all speak buffalo english
or michiganish either
though i'd like us better if we did
err all except me of course
i want to be as annoying as the late bill buckley

liking as i do
to appear
as if
a lord it over the monkeys guy

The late Bill Buckley was an exemplar of the Locust Valley Lockjaw style of communication. I'm familiar with the claim that his peculiar, extremely irritating affect was the result of learning English as a second language, but I don't buy it. That would denigrate the hard work he put into being a compleat creep.

Thanks for the link op. Pretty interesting.

This is what I mean:

"Despite its name, the phenomenon is not restricted to Canada. It is quite common in New England (including in the traditional accent of Martha's Vineyard) and also occurs in parts of the upper Midwest. Southern Atlantic varieties of English and the accents of the Fens in England feature it as well. ... The American raising of /aɪ/ can be found in the northern United States, the Mid-Atlantic Dialect region, California, and probably in many other parts of the country, as it appears to be spreading."

I can't hear any difference between a Canadian saying "about" and American friends from SF and Brookline, Ma. or american newscasters, actors, profs, etc. saying about. In most of flyover country I notice a pretty distinct difference, obv. with a lot of strong regional variations.
It seems like those on the coasts, most younger or more educated people and those in the media tend to use the Canadian raising. I think that's why "Individuals who speak with Canadian raising will frequently be baffled by reports that they are being perceived as saying "aboot"".

When you hear Seth Rogen or Michael Cera speaking does it actually sound like "aboot" or "aboat" to you? It sounds like "about" to me.

The cot-caught merger seems to follow a similar pattern:

"It is very widespread across Canada, the Boston, Massachusetts area (see Boston accent) and northeastern New England, the Pittsburgh area (see Pittsburghese), and is also heard throughout the western U.S. The latter seems to be the source of its introduction into the Midwest as it appears to be spreading eastward. A recent survey directed by William Labov of the University of Pennsylvania has shown that the merger can be found today among younger generations (roughly people under 40) in Kansas, Nebraska, and the Dakotas. It is also heard across much of Minnesota, Iowa, and Missouri. Similarly, the merger affects central portions of Illinois, Indiana, and Ohio, though its appearance in these areas may represent a westward expansion of the change from Pennsylvania."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phonological_history_of_English_low_back_vowels#Cot-caught_merger

bob:
'—it shews what little knowledge is got by mere words—' -- Sterne

From the Preface to the 1912 edition of Hardy's 'Mayor of Casterbridge':

'Objections have been raised to the Scotch language of Mr. Farfrae, the second character; and one of his fellow-countrymen went so far as to declare that men beyond the Tweed did not and never could say "warrld," "cannet," "advairrtisment," and so on. As this gentleman's pronunciation in correcting me seemed to my Southron ear an exact repetition of what my spelling implied, I was not struck with the truth of his remark, and somehow we did not get any forwarder in the matter. It must be remembered that the Scotchman of the tale is represented not as he would appear to other Scotchmen, but as he would appear to people of outer regions.'

Personally, I have a lot of trouble with the Washingtonian accent. Mostly in the way they pronounce the word "war" so that it sounds like "peace."

In only partial jest I say the phonic conundrum posed by "dd" or "tt" in American regional vernacular can be traced to the shanty Irish...

...wherein the word "bottle" is pronounced as

BAH!-ull

oops. Say, where'd those central consonants go?

I had a college roommate who pronounced "button" as "bud-in" but for some reason was hypervigilant on a central "t" in the word "mountain" where the central "t" was pronounced as if it were king of the whole alphabet.

As to Daily Kos... they were all aiming at useless corporate middle management anyway.

Over many years and through many locales I've gotten the impression that thirtysomethings and younger, regardless of class and region, increasingly speak one or another variation of (Moon Unit Zappa) "valleyspeak"... especially middle-class American-born Asian-Americans, most notably! Just another noxious cultural trend that is making this country an ever more unbearable shithole... although I haven't much love lost for most other places in their late capitalist glory, either.

lol @ the notion that affirmative action actually exists in the workplace and is not just a myth that rightwing demagogues perpetuate to keep poor and middle-class whites agitated and distracted.

aa is so 1990s, anyway! the only people still bitching abt this phantom are the same ARE COUNTRY reactionaries who insist with a straight-face that sarah palin is every bit as capable as obama.

oh, and jonah goldberg - he bitches abt affirmative action alot, mostly because he is incapable of recognizing irony.

HTH.

The "t" in "butter" or "bottle" usually isn't an actual [t] or a [d], as I realized a while ago from listening to a non-native speaker who learned to speak it that way and trying to figure out what he was doing "wrong," but an alveolar tap [ɾ] like single "r" (not trilled) in Spanish. I remember being surprised to learn this because I hadn't realized I knew how to make that sound at all.

The "!" you describe is a glottal stop [ʔ]. The most prominent example of it in the General American accent is in "uh-oh," but I hear it in how some people say e.g. "Newton" too.

Boink:

He just never saw Mike Myers' Scottish dad impression:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCrT96QJBfQ

StO -- The glottal stop for sure in "Newton." And in "kitten."

Great point about the single, non-rolling "r" in Spanish.

"thirtysomethings and younger, regardless of class and region, increasingly speak one or another variation of (Moon Unit Zappa) "valleyspeak"... especially middle-class American-born Asian-Americans, most notably!"

very true... it is especially noticeable in younger second generation Asians who try really hard to lose any "fobish" accent. In general, it seems like all over the world there is a convergence towards hollywood/sitcom english. While older people that went through the education system in say Dubai or Hong Kong speak with a strong British accent, the younger generation seems to take their accent from American films and TV.

The annoying part is that they do tend to pick up some vapid valspeak in the process. My own pet peeve is the use of "random" as an all-purpose adjective. sometimes its approving: "I love that outfit, It's so random" sometimes its ambivalent [when made aware of any fact about the world that you wouldn't learn from MTV, say, that Africa isn't a country] "That's so random", sometimes its negative [when someone says something that is perceived to be gauche] "that's so random". Basically anything that isn't "normal" is "random" with no further inquiry or elaboration ever contemplated. I can just imagine one of them looking out the window and seeing an asteroid hurtling towards their home, upon which they would disinterestedly remark "that's random" then shrug their shoulders and shuffle off to check Facebook.

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